MJEOL Confession

How do you feel about Michael Jackson? Got any info you want to share?

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Post by whisper » Fri May 26, 2006 5:20 am

Hey people. :D

There have been a lot of things going on behind the scenes at the forums for a very, very long time. And I just need to get this off my chest, so bear with me.

Newer members, you may not know what in the world I'm talking about. But that's ok. :P

Truth is, I've found out why many members come here, but they don't post. And why some members who were regulars back in the day, have settled at other forums like MJJF and MJNO.

Ever wonder why in a certain thread, there would be only like 7 Replies, but like 69 Views? Well I've been doing background research for a while with a number of members who don't post regularly up in here. And I really wasn't going to say anything, but I have to.

They haven't had a lot of glowing things to say about some of the other members here over the course of my communications with them.

But at first, I didn't pay hardly any attention to a lot of those kinds of complaints because I figured they may have had some personal issues with that member they were complaining about, and now they were trying to get that person in trouble unnecessarily.

I didn't want to believe things I've been told by some people who rarely if ever post here anymore, but visit almost on a daily basis. They've had A LOT of things to say about certain members who have been....um...less than respectful over at least the past year here.

As a matter of fact, I just finished arguing with a member who got an attitude because I put the kibosh on her behavior up in here, after she got an attitude, total over-reacted and began to almost bait me into a public argument. And it started with a freakin thread about a tv show, no less! Don't worry about the details.

Anyway, remember when this board was "thriving" whether or not there was any MJ news to report? Upwards of 30 sometimes 40 members online at one time throughout the whole day? That is 'thriving' for us. :lol

Well it seems that over time, many old timers (long time members) thought this forum sort of split into cliques.

Some of you may not remember the comments from one member a while ago in the Off Topic forum who was complaining about everything from the themes to the amount of people on here. And, how this member's comments were refuted by myself and number of other members. This member also said that certain moderators were running people away from here with their attitudes. Of course, i didn't want to believe it.

But as it turns out, this person had a point to a certain degree. Nobody will post here if they think that every time they post something, they'll have to do battle with a clique of arrogant members who think they run this forum.

I posted this because I recently hit my last-straw moment: having a long time member from WAY back email me to tell me that they were shocked that I was being disrespected on my own forum. And further, that they left places like KOPD to get away from attitudes like that.

Well that was it. MJEOL's forum has a reputation for being no-nonsense. It started as a safe place for people to rant and discuss Michael Jackson and related information in a respectful way. And that's the way it's gonna stay.

To have someone else who I've known for a long time pointing out to me that "u neva would have let us get away with a post like that in the good old days", and it "seems as if u have let other members control uR forum for a long time" was just enlightening and sad.

And she continued by saying "u used to tell it like it is, but u let some members act a straight fool like they can say what they want". I almost sent her a scathing reply until I realized she was right.

Ultimately, seeing how one of those unchecked members argued with me about how to run my forum, called me names and disrespected me has more than proved the point my friend tried to make days ago.

It's about respect. I'll give ya an example of respect. I'm also a temp. admin at MJJF. But one of the Moderators on there made it clear that aguments and drama about Debbie Rowe would not be allowed at the forum.

Did I get an attitude with her? Nope. Did I try to pull rank? Nope. Did I make some high-falutin argument about freedom of speech and being allowed to do what I want there? Hell no.

Did I respect her position and that forum's position about the issue of Debbie Rowe? Yes. When you're a part of something that you don't own, you have to respect the rules of that place. That's just the way it is.

Why do I tell all of you MJEOL'ers this? I say it because I understand now. Members don't like to be babysat, but they don't want to post at a place where a certain element can act however the hell they want to act. For many of these same people left other forums to get away from many placed that have become toxic. I vow that as long as I can help it, this place will not become toxic.

So to those members (who may be gone away from here for ever) who complained to me in the past about certain members (and sometimes Moderators), but I immediiately took their side over yours, I'm sorry. That's my apology.

It just took me a little while to realize that some of the ones I tried to defend to you in PMs and emails, ultimately didn't deserve my defense. Yeah, they were "bitches" just like some of you said. :lol My bad. :lol

I want to now clear the air up in here. I'll give you your freedom of speech so long as you don't disrespect me or your fellow MJEOLers personally or catch an attitude with me every time I do something you may not agree with.

Remember, I am not only a member here, but also the Admin which means I may do things you particularly wouldn't do if you had your own forum. It's not a personal affront to you, unless you want to make it one.

I want you to feel safe here. I am one of the original no-nonsense sistahs from way back in the day when MJEOL was still on InsideTheWeb! :lol

Now, let's have some fun up in here.:D

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Post by InMyPlace » Fri May 26, 2006 5:55 am

Whisper, I don't know if you realize but the snappy way you retorted to the members that were waiting for that ANTM finale that had it ruined...is the same attitude that you say... would turn someone off to go to another forum. That was COMPLETELY wrong of you and you don't even have it in you to knock your freakin pride down and say sorry to the people you pissed off. Don't play the victim...

If I had done that and it created a problem, you probably would have used it against me.

I mean your reply of 'Yeah, too bad.' Was that really needed? Yes, it may have been 'just a TV show', but that's 'just a TV show' that people have been watching for an ENTIRE season. No, it doesn't equal the seriousness of a heart attack, but it was of some importance...obviously, since you took time out of your day to even post about it.

You could have been a little more apologetic. That was a real turn off and a lot of people were upset with you about it, even if they didn't get to vocalize it in that thread.

That also equates into the 'respect' that members should be shown. Especially when all of the members you ruined it for have been regulars at MJEOL for years...you have to practice what you preach right?

So, the tension that we have 'up in here' did not arise out of nothing.

EVERY single MJ forum online has it's problems. If you go to MJJF you see people rolling their eyes about KOPD. KOPD hates everywhere else. Go to MJNO they ALL hate MJJF. MJJF hates MJNO. MJEOL is only thrown in the mix. It's one of the smaller forums, so I don't see it mentioned as much, but if anyone doesn't like MJEOL, it's not because of anything significant. You find where you fit in, and then start posting.

Do you think that all of the these huge forums like MJNO are running in harmony? Heck no. MJNO has way more 'drama' in one day than MJEOL will have in a month. I post there, I see it, I know. The bigger the forum, the worse it gets.

I don't know if you've noticed. But there has not been any real 'drama' on MJEOL for months and months. That's months and months.

We've accepted new members into the mix. Hello ajkinkycuffs...we're really all friends.

The problem has and probably will always be members vs. the admin. That's where it lies in almost every Michael Jackson forum online.

Sure, you have to put your foot down when it's needed...but you also have to hear people out, the PEOPLE that make the forum exactly what it is. Without us, MJEOL would be nothing. I know what it is and what it means to run a big site. That means keeping your visitors happy and showing them the upmost respect...even when they piss you off.

I've tried to give you 'advice' in the past...and very nicely I might add. But the only reply I got back from you was a very snarky, defensive, and accusatory responce. It was honest advice and...it wasn't something I just pulled from my asshole. It really was the concerns and complaints of a lot of members.

So it seems the rule here is, you can do whatever you want...but just don't have a voice and be bold enough to say it to the admin. She'll bump you of your position, ban you, mod que you...ect, if you do so.

Fair....maybe not.

That's my confession, I hope you don't delete and kick me out for it. Just because you are the admin that doesn't give you the right to act high and mighty. Your friend is wrong. If your members are telling you that you are doing wrong, perhaps you should check yourself.

ALL of the members that have left MJEOL haven't left just because people pushed them out. You are blind to see that most of the members that did do so, were the trouble makers. Tabloid Junkie, who is now gone, being the namely one was ALWAYS a trouble maker from day freaking one. Ask anybody here.

God, I remember one case where he started a thread bashing Lindsay Lohan, and I closed it and told him it was an immature post. And he got mad and went on this stupid triade asking everyone to leave. You want to take his side on that? Your perogative. But when almost an entire forum has a problem with one person...common sense will tell you that it's not just everyone else.

You weren't there to deal with all his posts, but yet, you take his side...and you don't even know the half of it. You weren't active enough then to get the full story. The other half, perhaps they just lost interest...and I assure you that's probably the case.

There are no cliques on MJEOL. Virtually all of the regular posters know eachother by name and we all talk to eachother. Minnie, Carla, Lucy, Emma, Jess, Carla, Acy, Mathilde, Krystle, Badine, myself, Felicia, Katie, Keerthi, Laura, Tara, Dana, Amanda, Cristine, there are more and we have some new ones too. We all know one another. And these are all your regular posters. We all address one another by name. In fact, you are probably the only one that we all call by your screen name.

There lives a group in Fan Fiction that never post anywhere else, so we never get to know them. Also a lot of your members are only registering for the fan fiction. They log on, read, and leave. I've seen it.

I can name some that have not posted in awhile...and it's not because anyone here pushed them away. Maybe they have busier lives. There are so many that used to be great additions here that we all miss. No one knows why they stopped posting. I had a friend Dorinda, that introduced me to MJEOL...she hardly posts anymore. I still talk to her on messenger, but she just doesn't post. It just so happens that way...no one pushed her...maybe she lost interest.

You sound like you think you have it all figured out, you really don't.

Don't blame us for the decline of MJEOL. Please, don't. There isn't some underground hate for MJEOL, it's not that big of a forum as compared to some of the others. Some forums just don't last. Having a lot of lurkers doesn't equate anything but just that fact. People lurk on the internet...don't have anything to say...they just read it and move on.

A lot of people also don't like how nice you get when they give you something. You start with the pet names like, 'V', and get all cheery and nice. Then after it wears off and we don't give you anything more, it's back to being condescending. That's ridiculous and insulting. There are people here with a bone to pick with you, but they probably fear you or what you will do...so they don't say it outright.

I can live with it though, because the friends I've made at MJEOL are dear ones and that's why we all keep coming back.

And thanks for calling us bitches, that was very nice of you.
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Post by privacy » Fri May 26, 2006 6:13 am

*bows down to Vicky*

Whisper, owning a forum doesn't entitle you to respect.. what fcked up anime series did you get that from?
I'll give you your freedom of speech so long as you don't disrespect me or your fellow MJEOLers personally or catch an attitude with me every time I do something you may not agree with.

That's so hypocritical. I've sent you PMs in the past trying to offer my help and all I got in return were two word answers or snidey remarks.
You can talk all you like about members being rude to you.. but you've been rude to me many a time for no apparent reason.. unless I've just donated.

You have closed so many threads of mine just because you didn't agree with them.. and then you complain about how there aren't enough topics being made.

Me and plenty other members are scared to speak up to you because your reaction is just banning them or telling them to go somewhere else. It's not other members that drive people away, it's you.


As Vicky already said.. there has not been any drama in here for ages and it's kinda nice. Just because you spoilt something for a lot of your members and someone called you out on it.. you ban them? Are you that stubborn to admit you made a mistake?
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Post by DarkChild » Fri May 26, 2006 6:13 am

You say that a lot of members here fear saying what they want because they might get slaughtered for it? Aren't you being a little bit of a hypocrite here lol. I think if any members here fear anyone the most, it's you. Maybe that's the way you intended, being the admin and all, but people never want to take a stand to you for fear of being banned...and one member did, and she was banned. You just made things worse for yourself there.

The member you're not-so-discreetly referring to is an intregal cog here in the works at MJEOL, as we all are. To ban her or whatever just for disagreeing with an unfair thing YOU did is totally childish. I understand the respect issue, and hey, I respect it. But respect is not a one way process - at the end of the day we're all equal human beings on an internet site. Attitudes, I am afraid, cannot be escaped when you're in a forum that is 95% female, and as Michael fans, we all have a bit of fire in us...you know, it's part of a package deal. It's the way we all are.

I hope you don't ban me for saying this, but it's my opinion and last time I checked I'm allowed free speech. I'm not being a bitch or having an attitude but I'm just pointing something out here. MJEOL is a bloody good forum - I've been here over 3 years now and I hope that I can be here for a long while yet. I've seen it flourish and I've seen a lot of wonderful members come and go, and I've made a lot of wonderful friends here. This place has a great friendly atmosphere - something that is seemingly void in others. You got a good thing here, and I think it's maybe unwise to get this way over one or 2 members who are, on the whole, largely respected and bring a certain je ne sais quoi to the forum.

Thanks.
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Post by privacy » Fri May 26, 2006 6:24 am

Ever wonder why in a certain thread, there would be only like 7 Replies, but like 69 Views?

That's usually someone telling another to empty their PM box and we're just all nosy fuckers.
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Post by whisper » Fri May 26, 2006 12:06 pm

Oh thank you for posting! Some of you are proving my point exactly. Of course some of you wouldn't see the problem because you've been part of it. And some of you are already pissed off because one of your clique members has been banned.

If you have a problem respecting me, then don't let the door knob hit cha on the way out. I woke up this morning to 26 emails and PMs from members about this thread so far.
Whisper, owning a forum doesn't entitle you to respect.. what fcked up anime series did you get that from?
THIS is a perfect example of exactly what I was talking about. Would you ever say anything like this to Paul over at MJNO? Or Trish over at MJJF? I doubt it or your ass will be dealt with.

I work damn hard on this forum, and I will be respected. I've never disrespected you, privacy. Closing a topic has a reason: either someone was fighting, or it was filled with misinformation, or some other reason. I don't close topics purely because I don't agree with what's being said. I may not post a reason, but there's always a reason for it. And it's an administrative function left to the descretion of mods and the admin. You knew that before you signed up.

And I won't accept anything less than respect from you. Or you're more than welcome to start your own forum.

It's mighty funny that at least 2 people who have replied to this thread are two of the ones I've gotten complaints about in the past.

I think it's interesting that I'm not supposed to have an opinion according to some of yall, but I AM supposed to let you have your say here, or else I'm the big bad bitch who bans innocent members. That's cute. :lol

I guess everybody is supposed to have an opinion BUT me. Ah, there's nothing hypocritical about that!

Perfect example of this is the Debbie Rowe thread. If I were all the things some of you say I am, I would have banned Allie instead of having the discussion with her about Rowe.

But yeah, show your true colors and keep it up. This is why as I sit typing this right now, this thread has 4 replies but 60 views.

Scared of posting because of me? Hum...well according to some criticism, I don't spend enough time here for people to be scared to post because of me. :lol However, according to some of the emails I've read so far, some members don't want to get jumped on for agreeing with me. :rolleyes: But that's ok.

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Post by privacy » Fri May 26, 2006 12:58 pm

THIS is a perfect example of exactly what I was talking about. Would you ever say anything like this to Paul over at MJNO? Or Trish over at MJJF? I doubt it or your ass will be dealt with.

No I wouldn't. You know why? Because I doubt that they demand respect. Now, I like pretty much everyone.. but that doesn't mean I respect them all. That's a whole different thing. People demanding respect? No, sorry.
It's mighty funny that at least 2 people who have replied to this thread are two of the ones I've gotten complaints about in the past.

Then why is it when in the past i've complained about a member and nothing's been done?
This particular member has sworn at me when I was honest to god nothing but polite (before he swore).. he was trashing my opinions re religion, sex, politics.

Nothing was done.
I've never disrespected you, privacy. Closing a topic has a reason: either someone was fighting, or it was filled with misinformation, or some other reason.
Disagree. No one was fighting, in fact only one person had replied. It was not misinformation. It was something about Michaels life that I did not know about as I wasn't a fan at that point, in fact I don't think I was born. I posted it here, asking to be told about it as I was interested and it got closed. Pure and simple.

Whisper, I do not like being mean. I really don't. Usually I'm just too shit scared to speak my mind.

You can have an opinion all you like, of course you can. No one can stop that. It's just bloody irritating that when you disagree with someone you just close a topic or ban them. I know it's your forum blah blah blah.. but.. damn. When I don't agree with someones opinion I just say what my opinion is and leave it at that. I don't report them or shit.
I may not post a reason, but there's always a reason for it.
I PMed you and asked you the reason. Your words were extremely similar to "Because everyone already knows about it."
I obviously didn't.
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Post by privacy » Fri May 26, 2006 1:08 pm

However, according to some of the emails I've read so far, some members don't want to get jumped on for agreeing with me.

I don't jump on people for their opinions. Only when they are being rude and mean with no good reason.

So please. All who agree with Whisper that banning someone for calling her out on something that she did wrong is right.. In any way shape or form.. speak out. I for one will not jump on you.
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Post by whisper » Fri May 26, 2006 1:11 pm

[QUOTE=privacy]I don't jump on people for their opinions. Only when they are being rude and mean with no good reason.

So please. All who agree with Whisper that banning someone for calling her out on something that she did wrong is right.. In any way shape or form.. speak out. I for one will not jump on you.[/QUOTE]
well, it's the opinion of some of you that it was "wrong". But the information was already posted on UPN's website. So I wasn't doing anything "wrong" and I'm not going to agree with you. That's your characterization of what happened after the fact, b/c you already agree with the person who got an attitude with me.

What started out of my joy and excited, quickly disintegrated into a lecture by someone who may or may not have known that the results were already posted all over the web. A lecture I didn't run away from, by the way. And people were allowed to have their say even in that thread. Some didn't agree with me on that thread either, but did I ban everyone who didn't agree? Nope.

But oops! I forgot I'm not suppose to have an opinion. :chained :lol

Oh yeah, by the way, I didn't delete that thread either. It was close because people starting fighting about it when they apparently didn't realized the results were already online. It turned into something other than what the topic was. I'm allowed to administrate my own forum, right? :P

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Post by InMyPlace » Fri May 26, 2006 1:13 pm

*Sigh*

Is this what the thread was created for? I don't have the strength to go through this. Especially when there are more important things to give our attention to.

Point blank: MJEOL was fight free and has been welcoming new members in very smoothly for months on end. It wasn't until that ANTM thread that any shit was flying.


Love you Acy, Lucy.

PS: Even if the results of ANTM were online, the people that wanted it to be a shock would not go searching for the results. I don't know why you mentioned that here or in your final reply to that thread. I talked to one person you ruined it for and she was baffled to why you mentioned it either. People who wanted it as a surprise would not go to the UPN site and people who live abroad don't even have UPN.
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Post by privacy » Fri May 26, 2006 1:21 pm

well, it's the opinion of some of you that it was "wrong". But the information was already posted on UPN's website. So I wasn't doing anything "wrong" and I'm not going to agree with you. That's your characterization of what happened after the fact, b/c you already agree with the person who got an attitude with me.

But oops! I forgot I'm not suppose to have an opinion. :chained :lol

Oh yeah, buy the way, I didn't delete that thread either. It was close because people starting fighting about it when no one realized the results were already online.

Being sarcastic isn't going to help this. I assumed you posted this because you wanted to maybe sort things out?

People who are behind america in ANTM purposely don't go to those kinda websites because of course it's going to say things like that. It just spoilt it for those watching.

It may not have been "wrong" of you, and you don't have to agree with me.. I'm just shocked that you can't apologise for spoiling something for other people, whether it was unintentional or not. What harm does an apology do? None. It clears the air and lets people move on. If you'd have just done that, we wouldn't be having this stupid conversation.


Vicky's right. We don't need this. We've had some bad fights in this forum and that had all gone away.. and now this.

Love you, Vicky. Thanks for saying things clearer than I can :)
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Post by HeavenSent » Fri May 26, 2006 1:22 pm

[QUOTE=whisper]I think it's interesting that I'm not supposed to have an opinion according to some of yall, but I AM supposed to let you have your say here, or else I'm the big bad bitch who bans innocent members. That's cute. :lol

I guess everybody is supposed to have an opinion BUT me. Ah, there's nothing hypocritical about that!

[/QUOTE]
I don't think anyone has EVER said that you were supposed to have an opinion, whisper. That's ridiculous. It's the manner that you sometimes convey those opinions that gets people on the defensive. Condescending comes to mind. From my own observations, folks start feeling like they have to be on attack mode or that they're fearful of speaking up or else they'd get shot down. Not everyone here is as aggressive and shoot from the hip as you.

In the very beginning of this year, I made a topic about all the drama and starting things off on the right foot. And I owned up to anything that I may have said or done in the past to offend people because if there's one thing I've learned is that different people have different tolerance levels. I did it because I've acknowledged that I'm no where near perfect. There's too many different types of personalities for me to cater to everyone, so I knew right from the get go that I'd have some people to disagree with me.

One of the reasons I did that was because of something you had communicated to Vicky a while ago about me: You had indicated to her that I was one of the mods of whom you had gotten complaints about. Specifically what I had done, I do not know. While I would have loved to hear that straight from you, I took it into consideration anyway, and started thinking about how maybe I had contributed to some of the discontent in the past. Life @ MJEOL is hardly something anyone should in a huff over. Really, it isn't.

I'm hardly one to start mess about petty crap. So I didn't start pointing fingers about who had a problem w/me and all that yip yap. So you know? I let it go, and looked at me. Self analysis is not a bad thing. It helped me understand a whole lot of the dynamics of this forum. A lot of the unrest can very well stem from yourself. It's not always everyone else.

I honestly do not remember you ever acknowledging anything that have caused resentment among your members w/out prefacing it with some kind of sentiment that someone makes it seems like its someone else's fault. I'm not talking about ass kissing--but perhaps acknowledging misunderstandings. It's always the fault of the members for not knowing what you meant, or what not. That makes people question your integrity in dealing with difficult situations. To apologize or say, I'm sorry...but this is what I meant..." goes such a long way, I don't see why it's so hard if your the leader of a board. You set the tone here, whisper. It starts at the top.

No one can deny that you're intelligent and opinionated and that you've worked hard on the forum...But no one's perfect and all it takes is bringing yourself down a notch to accept that.

I gotta go. I have more to add later...
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Post by privacy » Fri May 26, 2006 1:31 pm

Also.. I just want to add.. I don't want to fight anymore. I've said my bit and if you can't just realise that some people take things differently and react different.. and sometimes you just gotta apologise.. there's nothing more i can say.

I like pretty much everyone on this forum, yes whisper even you when you relax and be yourself.

I'm done with this for today. I can't do it anymore.
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Post by whisper » Fri May 26, 2006 1:35 pm

I don't think anyone has EVER said that you were supposed to have an opinion, whisper. That's ridiculous. It's the manner that you sometimes convey those opinions that gets people on the defensive. Condescending comes to mind
Yeah, and it's the manner they some of these other folk convey their opinions which cause other members to be defensive as well. And I'm certainly not the only one on here that has been called condescending by any stretch of the imagination.
That's exactly the way i feel. But because i'm the admin, peple judge my opinions differently. For example, if you post something where you completely and totally disagree with a member, it won't be an issue.

But when I do it, certain members take it as a personal affront, assign meanings to it which don't exist, and act like I'm the wicked tyrant of MJEOL. :lol
t's always the fault of the members for not knowing what you meant, or what not. That makes people question your integrity in dealing with difficult situations. To apologize or say, I'm sorry...but this is what I meant..." goes such a long way, I don't see why it's so hard if your the leader of a board. You set the tone here, whisper. It starts at the top.
Well, now we're getting into the area of telling me how to defend myself and my opinions. No one said it was someone's "fault". I would never tell you how to defend yourself if someone intentionally or unintentionally took your words and misinterpreted them for their own reasons or b/c they simply didn't get what you were trying to say. That's the point of discussion though.

But apparently I'm not here enough to set any tone. :P I didn't say I was perfect and I don't expect members to be. But hindsight is always 20/20.

It seems like you're telling me that I should respond to certain situations in a manner that you think I should respond, and not in a manner how I think I should respond. Is that accurate, or am I taking your words and misinterpreting them?
No one can deny that you're intelligent and opinionated and that you've worked hard on the forum...But no one's perfect and all it takes is bringing yourself down a notch to accept that.
Never said I was perfect. Bringing myself down a notch? Hum...maybe you should give that advice to some other members too. :)

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MJEOL Confession

Post by whisper » Fri May 26, 2006 1:43 pm

privacy wrote:Also.. I just want to add.. I don't want to fight anymore. I've said my bit and if you can't just realise that some people take things differently and react different.. and sometimes you just gotta apologise.. there's nothing more i can say.

I'm done with this for today. I can't do it anymore.
Exactly P! :D You made my day with that comment. People take things differently and react different. And sometimes you just gotta apologize. Some members take what I say and sometimes what I do as a personal attack on them, when it couldn't be further from the truth.

I remember BlameItOnTheBoogie sending me a PM where he had a fit because I closed a thread he started about the book rumored to be put out by one of Mike's ex employees. (My Life, or My Word, or whatever it's called :lol)

I didn't disrespect him in any way and after a while, he came back and apologized for the way he behaved because he realized that I wasn't doing something personally TO him b/c I closed his thread. There's the thread: Hey guys, I'm back...

That's all I'm saying. This can be quite simple or quite complicated depending on how one chooses to interpret the actions of another.
I'm just shocked that you can't apologise for spoiling something for other people, whether it was unintentional or not. What harm does an apology do? None.
You know, I didn't apologize because the situation didn't require an apology. There are a lot of things that happen on this forum which I think require an apology. But I never get one and I don't really expect to. Its the nature of a discussion board. And if i complained all the time about how people are supposed to defend themselves, or try to make them apologize for their opinions, this would turn into kindergarten. Yall grown....well, most of yall anyway. :lol

For some folk, it wasn't even that serious. But some other folk acted like I slapped them in the face and talked about their mama because I posted the information! And demanded I apologized for doing so. :lol You thought I should have apologized for posting info that was already readily available, and I don't. That's a difference of opinion. It's the nature of a forum where people agree to disagree.

By the way, I'm always myself. Apparently THAT'S the problem for some members. :lol :P

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